Just what did the Fench do?

beisbollover says on Jul 5, 2008, 09:35:

I am with you Rikito. I would love to learn what the hell Ingrid is thanking them for exactly. And if it's just smoke than shame on her. Hopefully there is something there I just don't know about.

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Simon says on Jul 5, 2008, 09:41:

The French didn't do shit! She should be thanking Uribe from here to Timbuktu for rescuing her ass!

HERE'S SIMON!!!!

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 09:48:

I copy this post I wrote in another thread

France did a lot for her, just keeping her in the spotlight put pressure on the government to released her and other hostages, they even sent that plane when they found out Ingrid was not in a good health. thanks to her the world new about the problem Colombia face with the guerrillas and the situation of the hostages.
Alvaro Uribe knew that and by releasing her he knew will score points too.

Another think i was watching France24 and they interviewed some Colombian people on the street of Bogota and the majority agree that she owed to thanks France as they did a lot for her and that in Colombia she had little support.
lets face it how many times we have been arguing in this forum about France thinking that the only hostage was Ingrid.... they kept their crusade until the end.

And as BamacellI said, she has thanked over and over again the government of Colombia and president Uribe and if you listened very well she said in one of the interview she said she was proud of being Colombia and the Colombians.
She has said many nice thing about the Army and the president, that now everybody has Uribe on a pedestal.

now it seem everybody is bitter just because she said Thanks to France. Jesuschrist.!!!

GET OVER PEOPLE why is so much hatred in your hearts... we should be happy that she and the others are alive and well

engage brain before opening mouth

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dwmte7 says on Jul 5, 2008, 09:50:

right on, simon....unfortunately, she pissed away her get outta jail free card by all this talk of hers and what she owes france.........boy is this anticlimax. she has her priorities all fucked up. i think the colombian welcome mat is being pulled from under her feet while we speak

dwmte

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 09:53:

dwmte i don't think so, i bet opinions will be different if she would have said thanks to the USA and move her ass there instead eh?

She is not different from many other Colombian hostages that as soon they are released they emigrated to the USA or other country.

engage brain before opening mouth

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tasco66 says on Jul 5, 2008, 09:56:

Sarkozy sent the French Presidential plane to pick he up....for his photo op, trying to get as much credit as possible, because contrary to Uribe he is not very popular in his country

Bravo, Presidente Uribe for the perfect operation!

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 09:58:

tasco, but all the credit even Sarkozy said have been for President Uribe....on France24 Uribe is the hero..... why people read on think what they want to see.....
I didn't like Ingrid at the beginning but i can see how grateful she is with president Uribe, she can't stop saying it. maybe we are watching different news.

engage brain before opening mouth

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:05:

i can't imaging if ingrid had done what Clara Rojas did the day of her released, kissing the guerrilleros, all "paly " with Piedad hu! the comments would have been worst!

engage brain before opening mouth

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sloopskipper says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:08:

What did they do? Well, . . . they posted her foto all over the place, and sent a plane, apparently without any plan.

All the news I have seen there was not a single comment about any appreciation for what the Colombian government has done, let alone Washington's role, after she disregarded advice and got herself captured.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:09:

although i do a bit agree with comment from tasco "Sarkozy sent the French Presidential plane to pick he up....for his photo op, trying to get as much credit as possible" I think it was more the French people than the presidents that kept her in the spotlight, it is the French people that love her and of course this is an opportunity for any president :))

engage brain before opening mouth

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tasco66 says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:09:

Kat, my point is that Sarkozy sent the French Presidential plane with the French Foreign Minister to pick her up, so he could so he could get as much political benefit possible from this event.

As Ms Segolene Royal, the previous Socialist French Presidential candidate said:
"Everyone knows it, it's a Colombian operation that was well-executed, that worked well, that proves that the negotiations with the FARC were useless, Nicolas Sarkozy had absolutely nothing to do with this liberation."

I know that Ingrid did not ask for this plane, but she could have stayed a bit longer in Colombia. I guess the French pressure was just too much…

Bravo, Presidente Uribe for the perfect operation!

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sloopskipper says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:10:

As many have predicted, we'll see how interested the Franch are now.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:10:

tasco read my reply above :))

engage brain before opening mouth

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:12:

sloopskipper says on Jul 5 (today): flag

What did they do? Well, . . . they posted her foto all over the place, and sent a plane, apparently without any plan.

All the news I have seen there was not a single comment about any appreciation for what the Colombian government has done, let alone Washington's role, after she disregarded advice and got herself captured.

Jesuschrist are we looking at the same news?

i agree she has not thanks the USA but gezzz she have been saying thanks you over and over and over to the President and the Army..

engage brain before opening mouth

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bamacellist says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:12:

She is also still publicly thanking Uribe and the Colombian army in interviews and comments she's making in France. All this hostility towards her expression of gratitude for the support she's received from the people of France as well as the efforts made on her behalf by the French government, whether or not they had any direct bearing on this mission, seems petty and misplaced to me. She has not participated in the Uribe bashing of her mother and her statements since her release are an absolute repudiation of her mother's disgusting behavior. The French, even at the height of the Chavez nonsense always distanced themselves from his anti-Uribe rhetoric and on a few occasons explicitly iterated their recognition that all their efforts were subject to the authority of Uribe and his government. I don't see any beef here.

She just spent six years living a life none of us can imagine. She probably feels so much joy and gratitude that she's afraid she's going to explode. Who are you to judge her for expressing it? I'd suggest you imagine yourself in her shoes, but really now, do you think this is possible?

"The future is much like the present, only longer."

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sloopskipper says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:15:

kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5 (today): flag

sloopskipper says on Jul 5 (today): flag

What did they do? Well, . . . they posted her foto all over the place, and sent a plane, apparently without any plan.

All the news I have seen there was not a single comment about any appreciation for what the Colombian government has done, let alone Washington's role, after she disregarded advice and got herself captured.

"Jesuschrist are we looking at the same news?

i agree she has not thanks the USA but gezzz she have been saying thanks you over and over and over to the President and the Army.."

I guess not. I get a yahoo alert for every piece of news that hits the internet which includes "colombia" which even includes Columbia, N.C.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:17:

again bamacelli great comments and i don't either understand why so much hatred towards her.

engage brain before opening mouth

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:23:

Like i said before, we were having arguments here many times on why France kept poking their noses in our business that they didn't care about any other hostages but Ingrid, that all the fuss they do about her and not the other hostages yet she is released and goes to say thank you to them for all that fuss they did, and what we do? complaint... where are our manners... :) we can't take all the credit

maybe Sarkosky wanted to gain get as much political benefit possible from this event as Tasco put it but lest face it so Uribe :))))

engage brain before opening mouth

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tasco66 says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:27:

What hatred? All I said is that she should have stayed in Colombia a bit longer (and that would have been to the benefit of her political career)

I guess many people on PBH don’t like the French, so for her to go straight to France and say “I owe you everything" was not very well taken here

Bravo, Presidente Uribe for the perfect operation!

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tasco66 says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:29:

“maybe Sarkosky wanted to gain get as much political benefit possible from this event as Tasco put it but lest face it so Uribe :))))"

Yep of course, but Uribe made it happen, what did Sarkozy do?

Bravo, Presidente Uribe for the perfect operation!

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:31:

tasco66 says on Jul 5 (today): flag

“maybe Sarkosky wanted to gain get as much political benefit possible from this event as Tasco put it but lest face it so Uribe :))))�?

Yep of course, but Uribe made it happen, what did Sarkozy do?



But really do we care? that is for the people of France to decided we better worry about our president :)

engage brain before opening mouth

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tasco66 says on Jul 5, 2008, 10:43:

Kat, did you see my comment on the hatred?

Bravo, Presidente Uribe for the perfect operation!

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 11:13:

i did sr and i am saying is seem like people have so much hate towards her we should be happy, who cares if she gone to France or timbuktu. she will be back don't worry ;)))

engage brain before opening mouth

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elmodefoque says on Jul 5, 2008, 11:22:

mi reina LINDISIMA, i dont hate that broad, i just think leaving colombia so quickly was a SLAP IN THE FACE of ALL PROUD COLOMBIAN PEOPLE.
I happend to like them french modefoques, my god parents are both french, living in barranquilla going gack to the 40's , they gave me this silly first name, but i have no desire to ever visit paris, if it aint got no pretty beach, with blue skies and coconut trees, i aint going

over 5 million colombianos in USA and only 27 barranquilleros, i'm one. CURRAMBA, EL MEJOR VIVIDERO DEL MUNDO!

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 11:27:

hellowwwwwwwwww look who's talking....



France don't have coconuts trees but other type of coconuts on the beach :P

engage brain before opening mouth

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Tolú says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:03:

Forget about Uribe and Sarkozy and politicians in general. The ordinary French people cared about her and embraced her cause, more than anyone else outside of Colombia. Her children were virtually "adopted" by the country. It's beautiful! I can understand why she was thankful.

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:10:

Simon says on Jul 5 (today):
The French didn't do shit! She should be thanking Uribe from here to Timbuktu for rescuing her ass!


==========

dwmte7 says on Jul 5 (today):
right on, simon....unfortunately, she pissed away her get outta jail free card by all this talk of hers and what she owes france.........boy is this anticlimax. she has her priorities all fucked up. i think the colombian welcome mat is being pulled from under her feet while we speak


=====================

kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5 (today): flag
GET OVER PEOPLE why is so much hatred in your hearts... we should be happy that she and the others are alive and well

Why do you assume we have hatred? You are confusing an open discussion with false accusations of feelings...just because some of us feel what she did was wrong doens't mean we hate her..HUGE difference!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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aztec says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:15:

"Tolú says on Jul 5 (today): flag

Forget about Uribe and Sarkozy and politicians in general. The ordinary French people cared about her and embraced her cause, more than anyone else outside of Colombia. Her children were virtually "adopted" by the country. It's beautiful! I can understand why she was thankful."

Good then perhaps she can run for the presidency of France.

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:28:

mafe what did she do wrong may i ask? a simple trip to France jezz how silly this thing is becoming

aztec perhaps she should stay in France, if we her Colombian brothers dislike her so much huh!

engage brain before opening mouth

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:31:

kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5 (today): flag

mafe what did she do wrong may i ask? a simple trip to France jezz how petty


I have no idea what "jezz " is..? Maybe spell check?

Ask all the other members what she did...in my eyes she left Colombia TOO quick..and said she owed everything to France?

As a moderator you should know and respect people's different opinions!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:35:

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

Ingrid may have her own causes

Elección no canonización....

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:37:

Gabo you are right...I just feel she could have stayed a little longer in Colombia...especially since her kids flew there! That's all...

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:40:

well said Gabo
I do respect your opinion but i do think this whole Frenchgate is been taken out of proportion, we have too look at ourselves first we criticizing Ingrid because she went to France and here we are living in a different country and proclaiming us Colombians lovers.

Many Colombians who have been unfortunate in Colombia had let the country due too many reasons why Ingrid have to be different!.

engage brain before opening mouth

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:42:

And I agree with you MaFe is just that this is so complicated... I don't know maybe she just wants to give herself a break... I am sure she'll be back... on the other hand if she is a politician her best move could've been to have stayed in Colombia and keep on gaining popularity (in case she wants to run for president of Colombia)

Vamos a ver que az tiene bajo la manga

Elección no canonización....

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:44:

WE don't know the true causes that made her to go to France straight away, perhaps as Poteña said she thinks she will be feel safer there for a while and can relax with her family while she recovers, 6 years in the jungle my God i would have done the same. she needs to relax and in Colombia will be difficult, thinking that the Farc might retaliate. she knows and we will know she is safer there for a while.

engage brain before opening mouth

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:44:

gabolicious says on Jul 5 (today): flag

And I agree with you MaFe is just that this is so complicated...

It is very complicated..gabito...but very well put!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:47:

Gabo do you think after 6 year in the jungle she has time to think what is good for her political career, I think she is overwhelm she wants to go here and there and see everybody, I don't think she is thinking straight, she is just happy to be free.

engage brain before opening mouth

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:48:

let's give her a chance... well i am after i talked so bad about her.... i changed my mind now

engage brain before opening mouth

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:51:

That is right Kat! I feel happy for her and I suppose she feels happier than me! =)

But politicians are politicians Kat...

I don't like politics but If I were her I would love to spend time with my family and forget about everything else... but I was not running for colombian presidency.... hahahahahahaha

Elección no canonización....

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:53:

Como dice Jung en otro comentario al menos espero que Ingrid se una a Poor but happy a defender al paìs que tanto ama y así se le perdona que esté en el extranjero... hahahahaha


=D

I am being ironic of course.

Elección no canonización....

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:55:

LIike us who are Colombians and live in the "extranjero" :))) and try defend our country and our PEOPLE :)))

And remember Ingrid is a politician but first she is a mother an as a mother her kids are her main priority right now

engage brain before opening mouth

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 12:58:

hahahahahahaha no lo dije por vos... vamos Kat no es un ataque contra vos es mera ironía

Pero yo ya vivo en Colombia... =D

No quiero vivir en otro paìs pensando en que me voy a hacer rico allá y después regresar a Colombia... yo no me hago rico en colombia pero estoy con mi familia y amigos...
Solo digo que en PBH creemos que tenemos el derecho de criticar las razones de alguien mas solo porque tenemos un computador al frente (pero tan pronto hablamos bien de colombia se nos perdona todo incluso a que vivamos en el extranjero)... y yo estoy de acuerdo con vos en muchos de tus argumentos

Elección no canonización....

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:00:

i know gabo, i just being ironic too jejejej :)))

since when you move to Colombia?

engage brain before opening mouth

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:03:

four months now...

No he parado de comer sancocho y pan de bono con avena jajajajaja

Elección no canonización....

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dwmte7 says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:06:

whoever....nobody said squat about hating her, nor about her being with her family whereever that is. only that her comments about owing all to france were way off base...fin. we heard feedback from the family in envigado this a.m. about it. colombia did it all and doesn't need to share that bandstand with anyone. viva colombia.

dwmte

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:07:

I completely agree with eveybody here, except for Kat, bama, and tolu. What an ungrateful fool!. France did not do anything!!!! Sarkosy is taking all the glory, he thinks by doing this he will be president of the EU, he is nothing but a clown. The Colombians and the USA did a hell lot more than those pieces of rotten fruit. He is not very popular in France and many other countries as well. Soon enough we will hear the negatives instead of all the positive crap that has been credited to that cretine Frenchman. Have never heard her say "Thanks" to the US for providing millions of US tax payers money so all this kidnapings, illegal drugs, terrorism etc stop finally Colombia may live in peace? Who provided the most sophistacated technology for her rescue? France? Is France going to provide for the next hostages rescue? Bet not, they do not give a sh** about the rest of the people.
The more I think about this circus, the more I feel like puking and sh***g my pants. Pardon mon Francais
Cheers and Farc Ingrid and the rest of the cretines

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:08:

dwmte7 says on Jul 5 (today): flag

whoever....nobody said squat about hating her, nor about her being with her family whereever that is. only that her comments about owing all to france were way off base...fin. we heard feedback from the family in envigado this a.m. about it. colombia did it all and doesn't need to share that bandstand with anyone. viva colombia.

Right on!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:13:

huskie, I don't think Sarkozy is taking all the glory just because Ingrid thanks him...

Uribe is taking all the glory around the world and that is what should matter to us... at the end of the day it doesn't matter what the french, germans, americans, think who the hell is taking all the glory as long as this works for colombians it is ok with me...


=)

Elección no canonización....

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:17:

well said Gabo :))

now where in Colombia are you base?

engage brain before opening mouth

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:18:

Bogota... I am planning to open an argentine restaurant... (to promote other cultures hahahahahahahaha irony again)

Elección no canonización....

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:21:

Gabo says:"Ingrid may have her own causes"
No doubt about that! She wanted to save her own agenda and cry and cry so more so people feel how wonderful, smart, and, bla,bla,bla, now, what is she going to do about the rest of the people in the jungle? Well I hope she plays and directs a commando to attack the Farc, since she says she has a PHD in Farc, and Mr Sarkosy provides the money for the operation. We will see
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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tasco66 says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:22:

How dare you say I did nothing for Ingrid?

Bravo, Presidente Uribe for the perfect operation!

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:24:

Kat1: Do you know Ms Betancourt's so well that you just love her to death?
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:24:

"Well I hope she plays and directs a commando to attack the Farc"

Esa no es mala idea, debe saber muchas cosas... pero espero que no se pierda en la selva y uribe tenga que empezar una cruzada para encontrarla, imaginate como sería: despues de rescatada la embarra y se pierde en la selva jajajajajaja

Elección no canonización....

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:25:

huskie says on Jul 5 (today): flag

Kat1: Do you know Ms Betancourt's so well that you just love her to death?

Very good question Huskie!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:27:

hahahahaha en esta foto Sarkozy esta tomando entrenamiento sobre como soportar el inclemente calor en la selva cuando vaya a rescatar a Ingrid!!!!

No lo juzguen porque aproveche el momento y se quiera broncear! hahahahaha

Elección no canonización....

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tasco66 says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:30:

Just saw Ingrid on French TV, says she wants to change the world…

She will be soon back in Colombia to prepare for her Presidential election campaign (she did not say that, this is my guess)

I think she believes this is all part of her destiny

Bravo, Presidente Uribe for the perfect operation!

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gabolicious says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:31:

Wow not even Gandhi changed the world... Ingrid, what if you start first changing Colombia?
Ciao

Elección no canonización....

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:32:

Delusional?. Mother Teresa to the rescue!!!
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:32:

moderators:
delete edit


MaFe says on Jul 5 (today): flag

huskie says on Jul 5 (today): flag

Kat1: Do you know Ms Betancourt's so well that you just love her to death?

Very good question Huskie!


sorry huskey with all due respect very silly question, i don't know her but i do give people a second chance and the benefit of the doubt, do you?

engage brain before opening mouth

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:35:

No!!
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:37:

kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5 (today): flag

huskie says on Jul 5 (today): flag

Kat1: Do you know Ms Betancourt's so well that you just love her to death?

Very good question Huskie!

sorry huskey with all due respect very silly question, i don't know her but i do give people a second chance and the benefit of the doubt, do you?


"kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5 (today):
GET OVER PEOPLE why is so much hatred in your hearts... we should be happy that she and the others are alive and well"

===
Kat Silly is you telling PHB members that we (anyone who disagress with you) have hatred when none have stated so, and making assumptions....

Kat..kindly remove my IP address...when you went to edit you left it out in the open...thanks

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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tasco66 says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:38:

Interview of Ingrid on French TV, for anyone that understands French:

http://videos.tf1.fr/video/news/0,,3900362,00-betancourt-appris-pardon...

Bravo, Presidente Uribe for the perfect operation!

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:44:

Thanks Tasco, I am ingrid-off
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:51:

well i am so sorry huskey..

Mafe i didn't notice that he ip person will show up, sorry about that will remove the ones i can edit :(

engage brain before opening mouth

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sloopskipper says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:52:

It seems that some people here confuse hatred and criticism. Those, who by choice, become public figures are bound to be criticized, loved, or maybe even hated.

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:53:

Sorry about what Kat
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:53:

kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5 (today): flag

well i am so sorry huskey..

Mafe i didn't notice that he ip person will show up, sorry about that will remove the ones i can edit :(
===

No problem Kat..It's still up..but thanks
It only shows in the comment were you quoted Huskie and myself..

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 13:55:

.

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 14:01:

I believe it's gone now, MaFe. I tried to edit the comment but Kat was there before me. I did the very same thing once and got a major scolding from a a member.

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 14:03:

let me know it is happen again mafe

huskey i am only saying sorry you feel like that way , i am a believer of second opportunities, we do all make mistakes and the end of the day.

engage brain before opening mouth

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kat1 (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 14:05:

BTW Gabo good for you were woo hoo where the restaurant it's going to be! i will be your first client :P

engage brain before opening mouth

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 14:06:

Desi and kat, it's alright. I appreciate you both trying to fix the problem and very sastified that you were both quick to fix it!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 14:13:

By the way, Desi and Kat, last night mine was left open as well and I got a couple of spam messages in my e-mail, one of those weird ones we have heard about the people in Africa inquiring about some very strange stuff, my laptop was in conflict with another IP, so please be very careful when you edit or do something that conflicts with IP's. I do not want unsafe and unwanted stuff on my PC
Thanks

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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Desideria (Moderator) says on Jul 5, 2008, 14:13:

I'm with kat1 on this one.Of course, as I have stated before, I have been a huge admirer of this courageous woman for a long time, even before her abduction. I admit that she has made some bad errors of judgement, like the one foolishly trying to prove her poont of not being intimidated by the guerrilla and venturing into guerrilla-controlled territory in her quest of meeting her constituncey in every corner of the national territory.

Perhaps she should've stayed a couple of days in Colombia, but OTOH, I would'
ve probably done exactly the same; perhaps she has had it with Colombia for a while and needs to take a little distance. There'll be time enough for her to return and recover her Colombia like she did before.

I'm really surprised huskie's strong animosity towards her. I thought you likes strong, honest, courageous and composed female presidential candidates? She's actually even more worthy than your idol Hillary Clinton; Hillary would probably been broken doen in 7 years of captivity with a chain in her neck that her jailers made tighter (making it difficult for her to breath) when they were in a bad mood.

"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them."-President George W. Bush

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beisbollover says on Jul 5, 2008, 14:16:

It seems that the French cared a lot and participated during the Chavez talks. I understand a simple thanks to France is necessary and I understand a trip there is innocent enough but the way she stressed her love and thanks to France seemed like she was either "dissing" Colombia, which she probably due to the fact that she is a politician without any power, or setting herself up for a life in France and inside French politics. Either way, the bottom line is, this is why the US hostages haven't given a single interview or been seen on any TV show yet. For whatever reason the US makes sure that the hostages are evaluated properly and given the time to reflect on all that has happened and speak with analysts/psychologists before going public with whatever thoughts are in their heads. Maybe Colombia learned something form all of this and next time will be more prudent before having press conferences.

I am proud of Colombia and Uribe for stepping up and doing something about the FARC. Uribe is the kind of president I want in my country too. However I think Colombia should be more reserved in the information it shares with the press so soon after a major operation like this.

I also couldn't help but think how this operation will never work again because the FARC can watch TV and learn exactly how this was executed. That's a shame for whoever remains as the new highest level hostage.

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 14:32:

Desi says: "I'm really surprised huskie's strong animosity towards her. I thought you likes strong, honest, courageous and composed female presidential candidates? She's actually even more worthy than your idol Hillary Clinton; Hillary would probably been broken doen in 7 years of captivity with a chain in her neck that her jailers made tighter (making it difficult for her to breath) when they were in a bad mood."
For heaven's sake is this the way you justify Ms Betancourt's populatity and admiration by so many fools? You got to be kidding me, yeah right, lets not start on Hillary now, she has nothing to do with Ms Betancourt's politics, believes or otherwise. There is just no way you come close to ...any way it's your comment not mine. That is all I have to say. I almost forgot, Hillary does not forget were she comes from and does not deny her country!!!
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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beisbollover says on Jul 5, 2008, 15:32:

This brings up a different but valid point. Ingrid deserves a lot of credit for hanging in there all those years under those conditions. I don't know if I would be able to be as strong as she was.

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 15:33:

huskie says on Jul 5 (today):

Desi says: "I'm really surprised huskie's strong animosity towards her. I thought you likes strong, honest, courageous and composed female presidential candidates? She's actually even more worthy than your idol Hillary Clinton; Hillary would probably been broken doen in 7 years of captivity with a chain in her neck that her jailers made tighter (making it difficult for her to breath) when they were in a bad mood."
For heaven's sake is this the way you justify Ms Betancourt's populatity and admiration by so many fools? You got to be kidding me, yeah right, lets not start on Hillary now, she has nothing to do with Ms Betancourt's politics, believes or otherwise. There is just no way you come close to ...any way it's your comment not mine. That is all I have to say. I almost forgot, Hillary does not forget were she comes from and does not deny her country!!!
===

Muy Bien Huskie! I agree qith you completly on this matter..
Let's not compare apples and oranges people!!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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elmodefoque says on Jul 5, 2008, 15:49:

USA gives colombia almost 2 billion in aid and france gives ingrid a free one way ticket to france and who gets all the credit?
how much is a one way ticket from bogota to france?

over 5 million colombianos in USA and only 27 barranquilleros, i'm one. CURRAMBA, EL MEJOR VIVIDERO DEL MUNDO!

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 15:56:

elmodefoque says on Jul 5 (today): flag

USA gives colombia almost 2 billion in aid and france gives ingrid a free one way ticket to france and who gets all the credit?
how much is a one way ticket from bogota to france?

==
One way first class starting $1820

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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elmodefoque says on Jul 5, 2008, 15:58:

i'm not that good in math, but if i'm not mistaken i think 2 billion is a little more than $1820

over 5 million colombianos in USA and only 27 barranquilleros, i'm one. CURRAMBA, EL MEJOR VIVIDERO DEL MUNDO!

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sloopskipper says on Jul 5, 2008, 16:09:

elmodefoque says on Jul 5 (today): flag

"USA gives colombia almost 2 billion in aid and france gives ingrid a free one way ticket to france and who gets all the credit?
how much is a one way ticket from bogota to france?"

First class or steerage?

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sloopskipper says on Jul 5, 2008, 16:19:

Talk and posting pictures is cheap. How many French Francs flowed into Colombia to fight FARC & drugs?

Many of the drugs end up in Western Europe, not ONLY in the USA.

Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against Ingrid, or France, as some of my sweetest memories are of the days I spent in Paris with my wife.

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aztec says on Jul 5, 2008, 16:29:

"beisbollover says on Jul 5 (today): flag

This brings up a different but valid point. Ingrid deserves a lot of credit for hanging in there all those years under those conditions. I don't know if I would be able to be as strong as she was."

This reminds me of a response of my late wife as she was confined on and off for three years at the Emory Hospital dying of Leukemia. Someone asked her how she endured? Her response?

What choice do I have?

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 16:30:

Not much choice there right?
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 16:33:

Oh I read she is in perfect health, no problems, all that talk that she was dying because she had Hepatatis B, and she has a clean bill of health? Hepatitis B, does not go away. It kills you slowly.
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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huskie says on Jul 5, 2008, 16:38:

I absolutely love France, all of it. But it's government at the moment sucks!
Cheers

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds-"

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aztec says on Jul 5, 2008, 16:50:

"US jamming operation hoodwinked rebels in Ingrid Betancourt rescue"

"American spy planes carrying sophisticated jamming equipment blocked frantic attempts by a Colombian rebel commander to contact his superiors about last week's hostage handover, The Sunday Telegraph has learnt."


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/colombia/225454...

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sloopskipper says on Jul 5, 2008, 17:08:

aztec says on Jul 5 (today): flag

"beisbollover says on Jul 5 (today): flag

This brings up a different but valid point. Ingrid deserves a lot of credit for hanging in there all those years under those conditions. I don't know if I would be able to be as strong as she was."

"This reminds me of a response of my late wife as she was confined on and off for three years at the Emory Hospital dying of Leukemia. Someone asked her how she endured? Her response?

What choice do I have?"

Aztec, I have been there too.

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billyb says on Jul 5, 2008, 17:09:

That answers the question of why cesar didn't get confirmation by radio from Cano. Seems like everything was so well thought out.

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dwmte7 says on Jul 5, 2008, 18:25:

that's what i was thinking, billy...thanks to the french.

dwmte

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briarblue says on Jul 5, 2008, 18:43:

Desi says: "I'm really surprised huskie's strong animosity towards her. I thought you likes strong, honest, courageous and composed female presidential candidates? She's actually even more worthy than your idol Hillary Clinton; Hillary would probably been broken doen in 7 years of captivity with a chain in her neck that her jailers made tighter (making it difficult for her to breath) when they were in a bad mood."

Huh? What in the world does that have to do with the price of tea in China? I'm nowhere near a fan of Senator Hillary Clinton, but to belittle her in a thread discussing Ingrid Betancourt showing appreciation for France's support sure seems quite distasteful.

As to Ms. Betancourt thanking the French---may come across the wrong way or as a little much, but I'd have to say she's entitled to express her gratitude however she fits.

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sloopskipper says on Jul 5, 2008, 18:50:

Most anybody must admire this woman for her resolve and tenacity, as stupid as she was to put herself in harm's way. But it seems, from what "I" have seen, her worshipping at the alter of France, and afterthoughts of thanking Colombia, and NO mention of the billions of dollars spent by the U.S. taxpayers to battle the people who captured her is unconconciable.

I am not a Bush supporter, BUT, without the dollars and support from Washington, this lady would still be in the jungle with the snakes and tarantulas.

The French only gave lip service to her situation, the Colombians, with USA support, bailed her sorry ass out!

It appears that the French didn't do shit!

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dwmte7 says on Jul 5, 2008, 19:14:

amen......

dwmte

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sloopskipper says on Jul 5, 2008, 19:16:

But, in her defense, this lady had endured an unbelievable hardship, so we must cut her some slack in for her judgment in her recent comments to the press.

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Lcacique says on Jul 5, 2008, 22:05:

sloopskipper: "and afterthoughts of thanking Colombia."

I noticed you said earlier: "All the news I have seen there was not a single comment about any appreciation for what the Colombian government has done..."

Here are her first words, before she thanked the French she thanked the Colombian military and says that she would not be alive it wasn't for their bravery. And says that the operation was miraculous and unprecedented in history.



Here she is thanking God, all of the people who prayed for the hostages (COLOMBIANS and French), the Colombian military. She also says she owes her life to the media...do we wish to critique her for that as well.



Here's the first article that I looked up and it claims that even Sarkozy applauded the Colombian government.

"Pope Benedict XVI was among the several world leaders, including Sarkozy and Bolivian President Evo Morales, who congratulated the families and the Colombian government for the rescue. Most called on the FARC to negotiate a peace accord."

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-hostages3-2008jul0...

Here's another article that pulled a quote from her initial response after being freed:

"She thanked Mr Uribe, against whom she was running as a presidential candidate when she was kidnapped, and said he 'has been a very good president'."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7486552.stm

I could do this all day, but what is the point. Regardless, I do not think you should blame Ingrid for what the media that you read chooses to report. As kat1 pointed out, her genuine appreciation for Colombia, the military and Uribe have been well documented. It takes a lot of work, in my opinion, to miss it.

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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Lcacique says on Jul 5, 2008, 22:07:

As for her wanting to go to France...shit, maybe her home there has a bigger bathtub for crying out loud.

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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Lcacique says on Jul 5, 2008, 22:17:

And maybe we should criticize her for thanking God over everyone else. Did God give any military aid to Colombia? Did God go into the jungle and save her and the other hostages?

A little sarcasm to lighten the mood...

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 22:18:

Lcacique says on Jul 5 (today): flag

As for her wanting to go to France...shit, maybe her home there has a bigger bathtub for crying out loud.
===

There are homes in Colombia that have big bath tubs!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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Lisa Zee says on Jul 5, 2008, 22:38:

Lcacique:unfortunately some of us are are blinded with hate and jealousy and only read and see what we want to see, and ignore all the positive and wonderful things about another people, selected memory. I guess the pope is also wrong?.... I said it before, you are brilliant!

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 22:47:

Lisa Zee says on Jul 5 (today): flag

Lcacique:unfortunately some of us are are blinded with hate and jealousy and only read and see what we want to see, and ignore all the positive and wonderful things about another people, selected memory. I guess the pope is also wrong?.... I said it before, you are brilliant!

===
WOW! How is this hate and jeaoulsy? Interesting...I supposed people can't have their own opinions? How odd! This is what adults do discuss and debate politics...doesn't mean anyone hate or is jealous of anyone!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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Lcacique says on Jul 5, 2008, 22:52:

Maybe not hers...and I know that Colombia has big/luxurious tubs...jajaja.

MaFe it is clear that you are pretty passionate in your disagreement with her actions, that is fine. I absolutely respect that. I simply do not think her travel out of Colombia is that big of a deal. I can see the point that some have argued and it would have been nice for her to stay in Colombia for a few more days or weeks for that matter, but to criticize her so harshly for wanting to leave the country for awhile seems a little strange to me (not speaking about you). It is her second home, it is a place that provided protection for her children for many years after they received death threats in Colombia, it is a place where ordinary citizens kept her name and her situation on the world radar. In my opinion, people are reading far too much into her saying she owes everything to France. Why shouldn't she be thankful to the country, at the very least, for providing a safe haven for her children? Her words, however, do not mean that she is not (equally) grateful to Colombia. It was simply an expression of gratitude. We all do it from time to time. She also said she owed her life to the media, should we be angry about this as well? She also said she owed her life to the brave Colombian military, are we angry about this? Since she has mentioned that she owes her life to all of these sources, should we force her to make a list of which of ones she feels she is most indebted to? I don't know...

I mean this sincerely and I am not trying to belittle your feelings.

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 22:54:

LC no hard feelings but Colombians would have provided that same environment for her children...she had no reason to state she owed everything to France...they did NOTHING!!

She owes her life to Colombia and the US...

I believe there are others here who have openly stated they feel the same way too!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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Lcacique says on Jul 5, 2008, 23:10:

I do not know if it is hate or jealousy or something else...Not speaking about anyone in particular, I am just responding to the comments.

It is interesting that sloopskipper would say that he has not seen a single news source that has written anything about her gratitude to the Colombian government. In an instance like that, should sloopskipper then reason that she feels no gratitude for the Colombian government? Is it her fault that the articles he reads fail to mention it? And when kat1 explains to him that Ingrid has thanked the Colombian government/people/military and that this has been covered by many news organizations, sloop still disagrees claiming: "I guess not. I get a yahoo alert for every piece of news that hits the internet which includes 'colombia' which even includes Columbia, N.C." Then he claims that she only thanked them as an afterthought...hum...she thanked them in her first speech to the media and she did so genuinely. So why the blindness? Is it a simple case of trusting yahoo too much for staying informed. A simple search and he could have read for himself the words that she dedicated to Uribe, the Colombian people and the Colombian Armed Forces...

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 23:14:

LC...sloopskipper said it very well....


"sloopskipper says on Jul 5 (today):

It seems that some people here confuse hatred and criticism. Those, who by choice, become public figures are bound to be criticized, loved, or maybe even hated."

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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Lcacique says on Jul 5, 2008, 23:20:

MaFe, she said she owes her life to the bravery of the Colombian Armed Forces.

I do not doubt that Colombians would have provided her children with that type of protection; however, considering the number of political figures who have been murdered over the years in Colombia, would you take the chance in her position with the lives of your children? Not to mention, that type of environment...knowing that there are people threatening to kill you is not necessarily the greatest environment to be raised in. Clearly, they may have been fine. Clearly, there were people who would have treated them with enormous care and genuine concern. But I think you must admit, it is an unnecessary risk to take.

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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Lcacique says on Jul 5, 2008, 23:22:

MaFe, no hard feelings taken. Like I said, I respect your point of view.

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 23:22:

No...her children flew to Colombia...again...

"sloopskipper says on Jul 5 (today):

It seems that some people here confuse hatred and criticism. Those, who by choice, become public figures are bound to be criticized, loved, or maybe even hated."

====Em Wolb Nac Ised (newbie) says on Jul 5 (today): flag

Your mind is sexy MaFe.

thanks

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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Lisa Zee says on Jul 5, 2008, 23:26:

"El peor ciego es el que no quiere ver"

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 23:34:

Lisa Zee says on Jul 5 (today): flag

"El peor ciego es el que no quiere ver"

===
-Nothing sways the stupid more than arguments they can't understand.
-Nothing is more terrible than ignorance in action.
-Ignorance seldom vaults into knowledge, but passes into it through an intermediate state of obscurity, even as night into day through twilight.
-Ignorance is the dominion of absurdity.
-To be ignorant of one's ignorance is the malady of the ignorant.
-Ignorance never settles a question.

-

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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Lcacique says on Jul 5, 2008, 23:37:

I am not sure what you are talking about, MaFe. I am talking about the fact that they were raised there and lived there because of death threats. I am not talking about where they are at the present time. And I am sure that in the current environment they probably would be safer now more than ever in Colombia.

I agree with the the sloop comment you posted, it does not negate my disbelief about his unwillingness to listen to her own words that she spoke upon her release. His statement that she did not thank the Colombian government is simply wrong. Therefore, I pointed it out. Earlier others attempted to do the same...but I did not say that he hated her. I did not say that you hated her. I did not say that huskie hated her. And my comments on another post about hatred were misinterpreted by huskie (for which i apologized). however, I do think that some of the comments go beyond mere disagreement. That's just my opinion. And like I said before, who cares?

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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MaFe says on Jul 5, 2008, 23:39:

LC...I have no idea...you agree with my point so I am unsure of why you targeted me? I simply stated what you just admitted to agree with! No hard feelings?Opinions are great...I thought you were saying some people hate..which they don't they are simply sharing their opinion as you are.....
which I respect...

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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Lcacique says on Jul 6, 2008, 00:09:

MaFe, some of the comments that have been posted about her recently and in the past lead me to believe that some people probably do have pretty intense feelings about her (and some of it seems rather unjustified in my opinion). Is it hate? I do not know or care. I do know that many people want to ignore the fact that she has said very kind things about Colombia that are comparable to what she said about France. In my opinion, it is clear that she loves Colombia and is very appreciative of the government (again, she said she owed her life to them).

I was not targeting you. We have a difference of opinion and therefore I was discussing my point of view with you. But I am well aware that we differ on several topics...that is not a bad thing. In reality, it makes me respect you even more because you are able to overlook those differences not letting them have a negative influence over our virtual friendship. So no worries...

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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Lcacique says on Jul 6, 2008, 00:11:

This kid is going to bed! Chao, amiguita!

Hoy se nota en la floresta un ambiente de alegría. ¡Y el rumor de ranchería es mas dulce y sabe a fiesta!

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MaFe says on Jul 6, 2008, 00:13:

Read your profile...I am following you! Chao amigito!

"All human actions have one or more of these seven causes: chance, nature, compulsions, habit, reason, passion, desire. "-Aristotle

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docwilliam says on Jul 6, 2008, 08:52:

What I heard a French Government spokesman say, was that they put pressure on Uribe to do something (my words, they were very choice in their words) saying multiple times "not pressure but". So it is because the French government put pressure to do something, that Pres. Uribe decided to go ahead and attempt a rescue. I guess they believe that prior to this pressure, Uribe never considered a rescure attempt.

"There's no time to panic"

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Lisa Zee says on Jul 6, 2008, 09:04:

MaFe: I am so glad we finally agreed! thanks for quoting me over and over. it makes me feel very special! :)

Nothing sways the stupid more than arguments they can't understand.
-Nothing is more terrible than ignorance in action.
-Ignorance seldom vaults into knowledge, but passes into it through an intermediate state of obscurity, even as night into day through twilight.
-Ignorance is the dominion of absurdity.
-To be ignorant of one's ignorance is the malady of the ignorant.
-Ignorance never settles a question.

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rocinante says on Jul 6, 2008, 10:16:

(AP) The three American hostages rescued by Colombia's military said in their first public statement that they are doing fine and are thrilled to "return home to the country we love."


Ingrid did the same. After being kidnapped for 6 years wouldn't you return to where your heart and home are? Where you belong?

I can't see berating anyone for that.

"World economic indicators point to a democrat winning 2008. It will surely be Obama. Peso 1400 by November" Feb 5, 2008

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Lcacique says on Jul 6, 2008, 11:24:

I agree, but her heart is shared between the two countries: "I am Colombi